Podcast Show #117- “A Deep Throat’s whistleblowing can start the unraveling, but it’s not enough!”

The Boiling Frogs Show Presents Coleen Rowley

Coleen Rowley joins us in a bold discussion on the recent developments involving NSA, congressional impotence, government whistleblowers, and what is really needed to bring about real and meaningful change. She talks about Obama feigning ignorance on his awareness of the extent of the illegal NSA surveillance, and how only moving chairs on the deck of the Titanic would probably suit everyone who was and is a part of the massive and highly profitable Top Secret America spy machine. We discuss Dianne Feinstein’s bill which is designed to codify the existing restrictions the FISA Court has imposed on the NSA, Edward Snowden, US Mainstream Media, how a Deep Throat style whistleblowing can start the unraveling, but not enough on its own, and much more.


Coleen Rowley, a FBI special agent for almost 24 years, was legal counsel to the FBI Field Office in Minneapolis from 1990 to 2003. She came to national attention in June 2002, when she testified before Congress about serious lapses before 9/11 that helped account for the failure to prevent the attacks. She now writes and speaks on ethical decision-making and on balancing civil liberties with the need for effective investigation.

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Comments

  1. avatar Michael Mendonca says:

    Edward Snowden’s state of mind bears no relevance to the information he provides; it only serves the government in characterize the people who support him, are offended or angry about the spying, as malcontents or mentally unstable. Focusing on Edward Snowden is a trick to divert us from talking about the criminality of the government.

    When a bully or a lair starts name calling you blast them unremittingly with facts until they have no choice but to acknowledge your argument.

  2. Of course the politicians know they are being spied upon, just like Church. That’s how the private oligarchy coerces them. That’s how the private oligarchy gets the public to point fingers at their only defense against tyranny, a publicly controlled government. Brilliant!

    We need to use the evidence to gain more public control. That is the struggle. Pointing out how much control we have lost should not cause the public to misplace blame and give up more control to private interests. That is the goal of the oligarchy and the anarcho-capitalists have taken the bait, along with those whose understanding and complaints are as superficial as the sitcoms they pay most oftheir aattention to.

    We’ve got the goods and can’t lose sight of the goals of having a transparent, publicly controlled system.

    Excellent conversation. Better than anything else available in mainstream or alternative media. Stay strong and keep up the good work!

  3. What makes podcasts like this so welcome is that not only is it informative, but heart warming. Both together are an inspiration. We hear in your voices and understand from reading of your adversities what you’ve been through. That you’re savvy to the challenge yet unflinchingly honest puts you in a completely other one percent.

  4. I’m weary of the Samuel Adams hero worship. Please learn the truth about Samuel Adams before you exalt him as a hero or symbol of truth and liberty. The man was a master of two things: propaganda and coercion (terrorism, as we call it today).

    I commend Sibel Edmonds for having the honesty, integrity, and self-assurance to say “I’m confused.” Though I didn’t think it was possible, she just elevated her character in my mind to an even higher level. She is a diamond.

    So I am inspired to make this “virtual” toast to F.R. Deniz:

    Here’s to the man who guided and nurtured the growth and development of the creator of this website. Without the courage and wisdom of F.R. Deniz, and his dedication to both family and humanity, we would not have benefited from the actions and insights of his daughter, Sibel. Through her, he has enriched and informed our lives. May we always remember his contribution to this website and our lives, and his example of how to live, both as a parent and a citizen.

  5. Can we pick a single individual, such as Graham Fuller or Marc Grossman, and target them for prosecution? If we find a hole to plug that represents a nexus between the GWOT, orchestration of al qaeda, illegal arms and drug trading, and the targeting of public officials using NSA spying, it could be a force multiplier in our defense against tyranny and a privatized militarized police state

    So, who’s on the short list and what tactics can we use to expose them and coalesce public pressure for a prosecution?

  6. avatar Edward Rutland says:

    Dear Peter and Sibel
    Thank you.
    Beautiful to hear so clearly the truth.
    Stay safe.
    Ps. You clearly fully and graciously made your points.

  7. I’ve not yet heard the whole podcast, but I was struck and very encouraged by Colleen Rowley’s comments confirming that, contrary to what the MSM would want and have us believe, Snowden, who one could easily have been traumatized by what he has gone through, remains very grounded and totally focused on the issue of surveillance and how the system may be reformed. One can glean it from his remarks and all of the disclosures, but it is that much more meaningful also to hear it from one of finest professionals and alumni from the FBI- a person who gave honorable service to the country- who has spent time with him. It is critical that, like Snowden, the public ‘keep its eye on the golfball’ and remain focused on how to fix the system, and in the most meaningful way.

  8. We need to use the evidence to gain more public control. That is the struggle. Pointing out how much control we have lost should not cause the public to misplace blame and give up more control to private interests..

    Wow Xicha…

    A very Great Point… That is the struggle.

    Thanks..

  9. Thanks, jin59b!

    I get tired of the disparaging, belittling comments by those who condescend to those of us who realize that a public government leads to liberty and a private government leads to slavery.

    And I wonder about the fact that we read and hear this fallacious individualism, promoted at BFP as part of a mix of philosophies. I wonder if that means we can never resolve this conversation. Like CNN having “both sides” of some issue, when they are promoting one of them by even saying that it is equal, when it is not.

    There is a way to resolve the question. That is to ask Corbett and Jiminez if they believe in the existence of a public interest. The one that I would specifically point to is liberty. (Kind of ironic that privatizers have hijacked that word.) Let’s find out if they think liberty is a public interest. At least give us something to ponder, instead of the incredibly frustrating condescension that gets repeated and protected as some kind of equal time here. (“Who’s gonna build the roads, right? huh huh huh”, gets a little old guys, especially after your private road theorist told us he’s going to put different speed limits in each lane. And listen, THAT’S NOT ALL YOU HEAR, EVERY TIME YOU BRING UP ANCAP! TRY READING THE COMMENTS HERE, MANY TIMES ON YOUR OWN POSTS!)

    Sorry, the more I type, the less I’m able to contain my frustration for the insults that keep happening here. How do we move on? Cause I’m not going to sit quiet out of respect for equal time (which isn’t even equal, considering no ideas critical of the ANCAPs are even offered here, except for the one debate posting, between Molyneaux and Willcutts.)

    And remember, even a Canadian guy with great vocabulary can be wrong. He’s said that he believed the 9/11 official story, hook, line, and sinker, for years. I hope, one day, he will say the same thing about ANCAP.

  10. avatar Luke Orsborne says:

    I’m glad Sibel and Peter that you again brought up the fact that the wiretapping of public officials has likely compromised their ability to work in anyone’s interest other than the blackmailing, blood sucking power structure.

    It’s a point that has not been satisfactorily answered, and yet it lies at the heart of how one orients oneself in the struggle for a better future.

    Reform or revolution?

    or simply wait for the social dynamics and power structure to play out and sweep us up as we debate the details.

    Colleen seemed to edge more toward reform with cautious optimism, but I did not sense the kind of belief one would need in such a course to pull it off, and the situation IS quite dire. How do you reform a system so thoroughly corrupted that is situated within such a blinkered society?

    I don’t think you can. And it’s more than just information overload, struggling to pay the bills, apathy in general, and oversimplification of issues. Marketing, fast food, public education, the corporate business model, and the entertainment industry have all been successful in turning us into essentially a traumatized culture of consumption and addiction. You’re not just fighting an intellectual or policy battle, but an array of conditioned physiological responses. Step into the world of addiction and recovery and you will see that the success rate is not very high. Now add the elephant in the room: rapid environmental decline. Bumpy ride indeed.

  11. avatar Luke Orsborne says:

    Also Sibel I believe you asked, will information overload cause people to simply further retreat? Will we just get used to the idea we are being spied on and do nothing? The conversation between Guillermo Jimenez and Jason Bermas touched on the same issue around the increasing coverage of Bilderberg. Are we just learning to accept our recently revealed masters?

    The internet provides us all in wealthy nations the ability to hear what you are saying, but that’s not what most people are interested in. Yes, these revelations probably are being normalized in our consciousness, but it’s probably largely due to the fact that people just don’t care, and they don’t want to live in a constant state of crisis or conflict. When the crisis becomes apparent by forcing these individuals into difficult living conditions, they may very well erupt, and when that happens, hopefully the efforts of those who are working to steer things in a better direction now will have set up the vehicle for positive change.

    My sense though is that because the forces at play are so wide ranging and tectonic in nature and any transformational/resistance movement is disparate and largely absent from general discussion, money, violence, and technologies which maximize profit and streamline violence will remain the primary organizing dynamics. The only way to avert this, if it is at all possible, is through some form of truly transformative action.

  12. Xicha, I agree completely with your comments and criticisms regarding ANCAP and the amount of discussion on the site without more alternate arguments (other than by posts by you and others). I do miss having the likes of Eric Draitser and other commentary with more opposing/balancing viewpoints. Thus the need for continued posts by others to continue to provide additional viewpoints. So, please continue to NOT be silent.

    Hal9000, I’m with you on the need to fully understand Samuel Adams and his true place history.

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